Comments on: The Disadvantages of an Elite Education

By: Zed

Zed — Mon, 11 Aug 2008 10:45:06 +0000

The writer is absolutely correct. And, as someone who wanted to get into an Ivy but never did–and am still bitter about it–it makes me feel just that little bit better. See, the smart aren’t really smart, and the rich aren’t really happy, and …

By: Wendy

Wendy — Mon, 23 Jun 2008 19:38:59 +0000

@Chris – I agree, no class can teach that. Then again, a well-rounded “smart” person knows that they need to find another way to learn it.

Do you think I am extra wicked pissed at this guy because I come from the land of dudes with goatees, Sox caps and Boston accents?

By: David Warde-Farley

David Warde-Farley — Mon, 23 Jun 2008 18:40:55 +0000

I can certainly relate to the "don't worry about failing..." bit. Joey, I don't know if it was like this when you were there, but in recent years your and my high school (and I suspect every other private high school in the city, most of all Richie Rich Academy) has had a well-known 'tradition' of inflating grades sent off to OUAC and other institutions, to the point that most of the final year students didn't give half a damn about classes. And while I won't deny that the academic standards were fairly high, admission standards sure as hell weren't (which is how the admission test was sold when my parents initially applied to send me there). If your family was wealthy and Italian, you would get into the school, and through the wonders of senior year grade inflation, you would get into the university of their choice. Even though I graduated in the so-called 'double cohort' year, the smug certainty displayed by my peers about their eventual admission to wherever they planned to go made me very cynical indeed. Coming from an environment like that, the dense, unforgiving maze of bureaucracy that makes up the University of Toronto was actually a welcome change.

By: Joey deVilla

Joey deVilla — Mon, 23 Jun 2008 18:01:46 +0000

@Peter Lynn: Queen’s students wear them with a sense of irony. Students from Western, on the other hand…

By: Peter Lynn

Peter Lynn — Mon, 23 Jun 2008 17:50:42 +0000

So, in other words, unlike Queen’s students, Ivy League students aren’t wearing their “Yes, I go to [insert name of school], and yes, I am better than you” T-shirts with a sense of irony.

(At least, I hope Queen’s students had a sense of irony about that.)

By: Chris Taylor

Chris Taylor — Mon, 23 Jun 2008 17:00:00 +0000

Not only that, Wendy, but Mr. Deresiewicz apparently did not learn even one iota of humility.

But it isn’t just a matter of class. My education taught me to believe that people who didn’t go to an Ivy League or equivalent school weren’t worth talking to, regardless of their class. I was given the unmistakable message that such people were beneath me. We were “the best and the brightest,” as these places love to say, and everyone else was, well, something else: less good, less bright.

…I never learned that there are smart people who don’t go to elite colleges, often precisely for reasons of class. I never learned that there are smart people who don’t go to college at all.

That’s the entire problem right there. Nothing at all to do with the education system or elite institutions. There is no undergrad course you can take to learn humility and empathy with humanity in general.

You either believe each human being has an intrinsic worth—separate from any deeds or accomplishments—or you don’t. He clearly does not.

By: David Janes

David Janes — Mon, 23 Jun 2008 15:20:02 +0000

Sure they can talk to them, you just have to have the right platform.

By: Wendy

Wendy — Mon, 23 Jun 2008 15:11:43 +0000

Big, enormous, pile of crap. He’s making excuses for his own personal failings. University students are legal adults who, for the most part, make their own decisions and need to deal with the consequences. I graduated from a terribly elite undergraduate institution which I really didn’t like for very real reasons, and I still have only myself to blame or congratulate for things I may or may not have learned there, ideas or skills, because I selected my courses, chose my advisors, did or did not do my reading, did or did not have deep, challenging conversations with peers or profs, did or did not volunteer for things, etc. etc. I even chose which school to attend, my mistake! I was a legal adult. It’s your own fault if you don’t spend that time learning the things you need to know to deal with the world. Not effing Yale’s, or wherever’s. Every problem in that article can be solved by individual students making good choices. People can be guided to do these things – and they ARE – but you can’t make ‘em drink.